NWB - Community Blog

HK Audio Elias PX - i've a system for sale - see earlier blogs.

If you have the funds go for an HK Elements sytem.

HK are not cheap although very good, however the new H&H range include powered speakers which is what i'll be going for and i think they will be cheaper, just waiting on the price list to come through within the next few weeks ;o)

www.hhelectronics.co.uk

you really can't get better or more expensive than the HK stuff - i wish i had the money!
However you talk about lighter and smaller and going from passive to active that is a contradiction in terms. most active system are going to be much heavier - a band i regularly work with has some carsboro active tops that damn near cripple me if i have to lift them on to stands!
Instead of thinking lighter, my inclination would be to think smarter, if possible.
wind up speaker stands and satellite poles are expensive but if i didn't have so many helpers i would gladly invest in some.
Alibi (friends but not a band i engineer for) move everything in and out of a venue in 4 wheel flight cases - the corridors in the bar can get a little cluttered but their PA and back line rolls in in no time.
A professional PA company i know use HK stuff and their bass bins come with manufacturer installed wheels not to the front but to the rear - wheel them in on their backs and then stand them upright. there is no reason why you couldn't apply the same to speakers you have already.
I always have a sack truck on the van on gig nights but it's the same sack truck i used to move my 4 x 12 cab 20 odd years ago - amazingly effective for PA speakers, cabs etc - everything but stairs!
If i had the money? an HK elias system, winding satellite poles and a couple of flight cases

@ H

Agree that HK stuff is pricey, but the Elements gear doesn't come much smaller and lighter and scaleable. However £2.5K for a 2.4Kw system isn't cheap.

@ Puppet Show.

I would want to have some evidence that the new H&H gear is up to the mark. I know it's a very well known name and respected, but it is Chinese made, (like everything these days), and with an unproven pedigree IMHO. Someone has bought the H&H name to try and get a flyer in the marketing stakes. Launching a new range of products without any prices is a bit iffy in my opinion. I am a massive fan of the old H&H gear, but this new range does not have the pedigree, whereas HK certainly has.

Adlib audio is up there at the top.

HK stuff is great.

Beyond that, RCF or Mackie for active systems

I have spoken with the chaps in birmingham and they tell me the prices are due any week now for the UK market, the guy i spoke with has been road testing the gear in his band for the past 12 months and seems to think it's every bit as good as Wharfdale, Mackie, DB, Behringer etc with very high quality internal components, i don't know about it being iffy, as far as i'm aware Laney bought H&H and they posses a good pedigree, i'm certainly going to be trying them out as soon as the dealer near me has them in stock, i guess time will tell ;o)

As I have commented on earlier blogs, we use a powered Mackie system that has been on the road on average of 3 times a week possibly more for the last 6 yrs without any problems, sorry, apart from a capacitor going on the full range cabs resulting in the bass driver not working.

Mackie and every other music related technical departmant told me I would have to send the module back to Mackie for a replacemant part at the cost of £185.00.................Our excellent teccy in Catforth has a direct line to Mackie's technical departmant in the US and fixed the module for £50.00 all in. Result

We use the SWA1501 bass bins, 2x SR1530 full range cabs and 2x SRM 450's.

The bass bins and the SRM's are Made in Italy/USA and the SR1531's are made in PRC, so not everything is bad that comes out of China.

We don't use the SRM's as well as the SR1530's together, if we use the bigger cabs the SRM's get used as fold back but if the room doesn't require the SR1530's we put the SRM's on satalite poles mounted above the bass bins. The bass bins can be moved by one man but it is best if two of you do it, the SRM's are a one man lift, again, many hands make light work.

The SR1530's are definitely a two man lift as they are not the best designed speaker to be moved around, a bit awkward really, but as we have used them for so long you get used to it. I/we will be doubling up on our system at some point rather than selling up and buying the newer Mackie HD series system, for the set-up we require the newer Mackie gear would cost us in the region of £4000.00 possibly more.

So hence looking out for some more of the same, which does come up on ebay quite frequently.

However, I personally think it is the best thing we did in selling our big, heavy, time consuming and not particulary great sounding old Peavey system along with the CS1000 power amps, Geoff Capes wouldn't have been able to lift our power amp flight case of that time, grim.

Go powered Tony, HK gear is top drawer but can you warrant the outlay for what you're likely to earn back? Not forgetting Nigel, he isn't keen on the new desk so god help wnating a change in PA.............You can check out our Mackie stuff when we play at Nigel & Mary's 60'th next month.

Lee :)

@ Puppet Show.
I'm not saying the gear is "iffy" by any means, no-one knows as you can't get hold of it. I just think it is a bit of a mistake to launch a product that people like yourself are lusting after and no prices.....
It's a bit like shooting yourself in the foot. Not sure a comparison with Behringer is a good idea either. :-)
It's funny you should mention Laney as they don't make their own gear. A lot is made in PRC but any of the "UK made" speaker cabs, (along with those from Ashdown, Orange, HiWatt, Cornford and a good few others), are made by a third party company. The Orange valve gear is made by the same company.

I can't comment on the more expensive stuff, but we've just bought 4 Alto TS112A powered speakers. Light, small and really clear. We used them last night at the Hindley Arms (2 as tops and 2 as monitors) and they sounded great (just vocals through them). They're also a damn sight more portable than 2 big passive 15" tops, 2 wedge monitors and a power amp.

They're £440 a pair from DV247, although I got one pair cheaper as B stock. The new ones have a 4 yr guarantee too.

Andy

Just to follow on from Lee / The Kasuals comments about Mackie, we've been using just 2 x Mackie 450's plus a 150w foldback system, which has been ample for all of the pub/club gig's we've done, as we only occasionally mic' up the drums, so it's mainly just vocals and electro acoustic. I picked these up on Ebay, 3 years ago, along with all cables, poles, monitors and a separate mixer for just over £800. In past couple of weeks I decided to try and expand the set up to include 2 sub-woofers, and this past weekend bought 1 x SWA 1501 (500watt) and also 1 x SRM 1801 (800watt) at a combined cost of just over £600. So we now have a decent 2+kw fully powered rig, totally adequate for most if not all of the local gig circuits, at a cost of little over £1400. Don't buy new unless you've got deep pockets - trawl ebay and Gumtree, bide your time, and you should get a result. There's a guy in Edinburgh who's currently selling a full Mackie set up on Gumtree, with 2 x 450's plus 2 x SRM 1801's, with poles and cables for £1500 - if I hadn't already got 2 fine 450's of my own, I'd have done a deal with this guy.
Good Luck,
Norman

RCF owns DB, I'm led to believe that RCF drivers are also found in other high quality manufactures including JBL DB & HK.

I've got a pair of RCF Active 322A mint with covers FORSALE. 350w on the 12" + 50w on the horn, which is a long throw 2" throat horn. PM me if interested.

I've noticed that these 322A's are sweeter and louder than the mackies 450 even though mackies are 350w on the 12" and 100w on horn. Mackies can sound harsh at high frequencies almost ear-pain.

---

Wattage is not really power measurement, its dbl's (SPL) @ 1 mtr, is generally the industry standard. A one decibel increase after 126+ is a noticable increase. 127-128 is Loud generally only the higher quality manufacture can get this rating at 400w. 132-133 is generally 800w and 134 is 1000W. Compare the dbl's ratings not wattage against top quality manufactures against cheeper manufacture and you'll see.

Manufacture-A rates their cab 400w @ 124 db(SPL) verse..
Manufacture-B rates their cab 400w @ 127 db(SPL) ...which is the loudest ?

...Manufacture-B !!

Mackies can sound a bit harsh in the mid-range if you over drive them or don't eq them correctly, I have been using these for years now so know the limitations of them.

RCF do in fact make drivers for other manufacturers who then in turn put there own badge on the magnet.

You can still buy the RCF drivers that were fitted to the version 1 SRM's, but they aint cheap, around £170/80 each + p&p from Italy.

Some of the higher end QSC powered speakers are pretty decent, especially the ones built in the wooden cabs, 12" versions retail around £1400 a pair.

Lee :)

QSC K series is BRILLIANT ! The K12s are 1000 watt @ 131 DB
I have demoed these side by side with the new
RCT ART series ... EV live series and the new JBL powered stuff ..and Mackies
The QSC blew them all away by a mile .. Go listen