NWB - Community Blog

or the uncensored version of "community property"?? dtabm!!!:-)

yeah, lets make it a yearly occasion. Wouldn't it be good if we got an unsigned band at the top? What about our own Uncle Rotter - Fit Goth Chicks as Xmas no1! that'd be sweet and funny as hell.

yeah-is why i "refrained"? makes one wonder??? cowell may be a d*ckhead, but he's one smart cookie when it comes to manipulation of the "pop" music scene- he knows exactly how to hit the "lowest common denominator" button every time-is why he's stinking rich? :-/.

yeah cowell makes money but its not his tv programme thats resulted in a number 1 again. a victory me thinks!

ive seen Rage twice love em, at wembley arena it was one of the craziest powerful gigs i have ever been to SO HAPPY!! i bought the download twice, even though i have the original album from the early 90's :-)

cowell only works for sony/bmg, that label is totally huge anyway

i had a £1 bet on with mother. Wish i had put a proper bet on at bookies.

Hooraaaaayyyyyyyyy.. at last..a Christmas number 1 that hasn't got there by manipulating the British publics way of thinking..errrr..ang on!

haha Kev ... free will 'n all that!! its the stuff of legend.
Willow

Yes Bat...i have to agree, it wud be sweet for Fit Goth Chicks to be next years Xmas No1!! :)

@ Kev and Willow
I know what you guys are meaning, the song is ironic cos we are all being told what to buy, and its only got there because of that campaign. BUT! If we all decided to purchase a song that we liked and wanted to be No1, chances are that we would each choose a completely different track from the next person. So a handful of sales for each of these tracks we buy, would not have affected the X Factor one bit, so X Factor would have got to no1. We had to gang together and all buy one same song, to ensure our chances of knockin Elderberry off the No1 spot. And the choice was RATM, and not a bad one, i don't think, going off lyrics, music and the fact they are donating a large portion to UK charities.

fair point bat..but I dont remember Mull of Kintyre having a massive campaign for it to reach number 1..and my band was number 2 in the charts that week..I hate McCartney..lol

But the main thing there is, which is the point i'm making, X Factor or any other shitty reality pop crap talent program wasn't around then.
The only reason we have had to do this, is because the likes of X Factor exists here and now. If it didn't and there were no other reality tv music talent show, popping out a single on the Xmas No1 week, then it would be open to a decent no1 who have got there from their own promoted means. X Factor is bad cos for 12 weeks, or maybe more, Elderberry has had weekly exposure to millions of people. The likes of Muppets, Journey, etc, haven't got a chance against X FaCTOR as their promotion is not to X Factor standard.
Without the facebook campaign, RATM would not have got to No1, neither would have any others, and we would be having another X Factor Xmas no1.
If X Factor died on its arse tomorrow, and no other programme replaced it, the charts would be open to anyone, with everyone on a similar level of promotion, each with an equal chance at gaining an Xmas No1. This is what the aim is. Oh, and i hate Paul McCartney too. lmao.
@ Toe, damn straight, sister!

@Bat .... and the point of keeping anyone off number 1 is what exactly?? I don't know but I would be prepared to guess that Joe X Factor has sold more copies of his single getting to #2 than if he'd been unopposed for #1. Now that would be interesting wouldn't it.
I'm not being arsey, I just honestly don't understand the real point of it all .... you can talk all you like about all this 12 week XF promotion .. fair enough, but what's radio 1 all about, they choose a playlist, they choose what records to play weeks in advamce of release ... those records then get bought by the shedload ... what's the difference..... but STILL ... what does it matter .. it's the POP music charts ... it's for KIDSSSS!! gggrrrrr! LOLOL
...... gets off soapbox .....
Willow

rage against the machine are number 1,
i like rage against the machine.
i'm happy :-)

@ the Big Fish-absolutely, willow-i would very much like someone to explain to me just WHY it is so vital to have a "xmas number one"-could it be that's when most people spend money on records (sorry-showing my age here!!!). plus-it has always been a case of hypeing up a particular band to make the charts-as far back as the mid sixties some sharp record company dude(ss) realised that there is a huge amount of money to be made, from record sales, merchandise and the occasional "tour". in case you "young uns" don't remember-errm-"the monkees"???? all through the last three decades there have been "reality tv" programmes pushing particular records-"juke box jury", "top of the pops"(forgotten that one, hadn't we?? biggest pusher of a particular brand of "music" ever!!)and many more-the "alternative" music programmes were put out at silly times on what was then the "minority channel (beeb 2) in the form of the "whistle test" and treated as some kind of eccentric silliness by the media.thus it has always been, thus it will stay.
:-(

i really like rage against the machine,
i've had the cd for 17 years
i've bought the single download twice
i like them
thats why i bought it again

maybe im missing a bigger picture or debate here, but thats why i'm pleased personally :-)))))))))))))))))

I understand the reason behind the campaign Bat and don't wholy disagree with it. Just seems a bit peevish to me..let the young lad have his 15 mins of fame and if Cowell makes more money that he can spend in a lifetime so what?..

people power has told Cowell he no longer has the ability to control the Xmas No. 1.

Next year he will have to think of summat else...

Or fuck off.

THAT'S whats important here.

ok..just ask yourself..how long has the music industry been controled by marketing of one form or another?..the defence rests m'lud

@ robert redfern-hear what you say, bro-and, as kev says, haven't a major objection in principle of giving the "finger" to the moguls who run the music industry (and-let's have no illusions-that's what it is-an industry)-however-that's all it will be-- a "one off" - because, unfortunately, radar, cowell WILL think of something else, if not him, somebody will. isn't it the case that all that has happened is ratm have now got THEIR fifteen minutes? good for them, if so-my view is that the only people who will come out of this better off are the shareholders of the record companies.

If I'm being totally honest, I'm glad I don't listen to the radio or watch mainstream programming. I can think of nothing worse than hearing RATM hour after hour.

I mean, I like the song, and the band to an extent. Apart from the angry shouty bastard. They should have got a singer in the first place. lol.

*puts flame suit on*

Prime time TV is a pretty huge and unfair marketing tool that is used to propell the X-factor winner to a guaranteed xmas No.1

It's moraly wrong and unfair to the rest of the artists aiming for the prestigeous xmas no.1 spot.

It needs to be stopped.

@ radar-again-i hear you-but it's always been that way, started with elvis and continued from there-the only way to break that strangle hold is for EVERYONE to STOP buying - that is never going to happen. and again-i ask-isn't it "prestigious" only in terms of monetary value? :-(

Or a MAJORITY to buy somethin else.

That happened....:-)

@ radar-was it a "majority"? or just a relatively few dedicated people? most observers reckon it was a damn close run thing:-)

@Viking-Close run it was. BUT MORE people bought the RATM than the X-factor......that IS a majority

@Radar ... in case you missed it the first time ... i repeat "but what's radio 1 all about, they choose a playlist, they choose what records to play weeks in advamce of release ... those records then get bought by the shedload ... what's the difference"
That is prime time radio and is a pretty huge and unfair marketing tool. If that didn't exist something else would.

and, by the way, no-one has yet explained why the xmas #1 is prestigious - i wouldn't think anyone on this site would give a rats arse! Simon Cowell i imagine gets the same hard on for 450,000 Joe sales and #2 as for, say, 400,000 sales and #1

Willowstillnotunderstanding

@ radar-possibly-but-if there hadn't been that campaign started, how many people would have bought something else? ratm's record suited the purpose,methinks? "f*ck you ,i won't do what you...." fitted in nicely. we will have to agree to differ on what constitutes a "majority". :-)

"and, by the way, no-one has yet explained why the xmas #1 is prestigious"

A VERY good point.

@Bad Horsie-Noddy would be best qualified to explain that one ;-)

2 little boys for 2010 christmas no 1...oh yeeeeeeeeeeeehhh..bring it on...lol

@ the urban bassman(kev ex minim)-nahhh-let's start a campaign to resurrect (is that the correct term?) dora bryan-don't get much more anarchic than that!! :-)
and radar- "-Noddy would be best qualified to explain that one"
you make my point most eloquently. :-)

Posted by the urban bassman (Kev ex MinI... - 20/12/2009, 22:53 (GMT)
My moneys on Floral Dance (Oooooops)

Im in Viking...all I want for Christmas is a beatle..get one now while stocks last..lol..oops!

Ill av sum of that Keef..lol..I looked very fetching in my purple uniform..lol

@ keef and kev-pmsl!! ;-)

@ Willow, Viking, Kev
"i wouldn't think anyone on this site would give a rats arse"
Yes, nobody on this site gives a 'rats arse' about the charts because on here we are all 'musicians'. But there's a large portion of the population who do give a toss about the charts, and if you want a hit, its better to be in the charts than to not be. A Xmas no1, for instance, would propel a band into the limelight and earn them huge rewards. If you were an originals band and had a chance to have your single in the charts or not, wouldn't you want it to be? Wouldn't you want to earn a living through doing what you enjoy and hope other people across the country like your music too? Many of these unsigned bands, or bands that have just gained management would love a slice of the chart pie - just because some NWB'ers think its a whole load of balls, doesn't mean the rest of the country thinks that way. Its fans and people who listen to music that help determine how successful a band is. If no-one comes to watch you or buys your cds, then your not gonna get anywhere. Being No1 in any given time, more so Xmas with the amount of publicity, or even getting high in the chart, is a goal because of the publicity and the kudos that comes with it. And i think that bands that havent had the publicity that X Factor has should be allowed a chance to shine, and not be pushed to the back by X Factors Guaranteed Xmas No1.
I'm with Robert Redfern: I like RATM, its cool they won.

you make a very good argument Bat and your heart is certainly in the right place, but, selling records has always been about promotion and the simple rule is, the more brass you have the more you can promote a single/album/band. The proof of the pudding is in longevity, yes, you need that initial push, but if you are a class act you can go the distance. X-fiction has all the clout to push artists but how many make it big time? Steve Brookstein?, Leon Jackson? et al. Maybe some pig ugly woman from Scotland will get the chance one day...oh..errrr... great blog this by the way !!!

Lets just say we'll agree to disagree on this one Bat. I'm glad for people who like the band.

Merry Xmas everyone! xxx
Willow

Thanks Kev, i'm glad you see where i'm coming from. All i'm saying is, being in the charts can give you that boost and once you got the attention of those people, the rest will follow, should you have the skills and the songs to do well.
Agreed Willow.

If you like RATM (which I don't) Great....

Don't Give Joe X Factor winner grief though, that is someone's son, good luck to the lad.....

X-factor has produced great talent like it or not - Leona Lewis for example......CLASS singer.

..and at the end of the day, of course RATM would be no-where near top spot without the 'campaign'.

@Willow- it's the POP music charts ... it's for KIDSSSS!!

EXACTLY that's the point!!!!!!!!


"and, by the way, no-one has yet explained why the xmas #1 is prestigious"

Well it certainly isn't for me or I suppose for many people on this site. It is however very important for those who pedal this bullshit. Those whose job it is to build up the hype will have to rethink their strategy, this will effect quite a few people in the business of extreme arrogance- aka the music industry.

Of course Cowell will make millions no matter what happens but when people stop being able to deliver the goods then their position will eventually come into question. Just look at Mark Hughes!!!

You never know, if we all buy a record from an independant label next year then that could be the straw that breaks the camels back. Cowell could get sacked and the big wigs do a U turn on their policy of force feeding us sugar coated pop for kids and teenagers. Ahhh! I hear you snigger.... well Ben Murrey said about RATM for xmas no.1 - "It won't happen in a million years." It actually took less than a week.

And no the music industry hasn't been this bad before, all the singers produced for the charts sound, look and dance the same, where is the next Lou Reed, Bob Dylan or Neil Young going to come from? EMI, A&M and Virgin all signed The Sex Pistols - Is that likely to happen again?

F*ck you I won't buy what you tell me!!

Wel the Pistols were a boy band. Mclaren drove that bus.

Looking back on the way broadcasting media has evolved I can't see how the industry could NOT be like it is. Sugar coated pop is what 90% of the population want. It's the reason the industry works. If it didn't work the business model would be different. Business is what it is. It just got more efficient because of technology. Yes, it sucks a little if you're trying to make it as an originals band, but there are alternatives to "getting a deal" these days. The internet can get your music out to the masses. Bands have to adapt. I personally believe there are more mediums to get music out there now than there have ever been without needing a "record deal". The problem that there has always been is that most bands need financial input to get themselves physically out there.

Sugar coated pop is certainly NOT what 90% of the population want, that is completely untrue (but at 2am that's understandable). 90% of the record buying public however may want it. For years I've been putting the blame at the feet of the people who moan at the state of the charts but haven't bought a record for years. It's a bit like not having the right to moan about the way the country is being run if you don't vote.

Yes the Pistols were a boy band but I don't have a problem with boy boy bands providing they can write, play and perform live with a bit of character. The Beatles and The Stones were no different but they were picked because they were talented and not because they were safe. I can't think of a more unsafe band than the Pistols - certainly not at that time.

If it is not what the population want, explain Mcdonalds, KFC, Eastenders, X factor, Britains got Talent, Strictly Come Dancing. A marketable formula will win every time. People LIKE easy choices.

This is the christmas list of UK Number One hits back to 1952. A list spanning over half a century and apart from this contraversial anti Cowell knee jerk single, it's all packaged marketability, right back to Al Martino an Frankie Lane.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Christmas_number_one_singles_%28UK%29

I wish it were a different industry, and that we could all make a living out of it as musicians. As it stands, and has stood for a long time, we as players put a lot more importance on our passion (music) than the rest of the non playing world does. DJs are more popular than live bands. There's a reason for that and we have to deal with it.

Well 90% of the population don't eat at Macshit or KFC or watch any of those shows either but I take your point. The reason that people have been happy to be "dumbed down" is perhaps going too far off thread.

I don't have a problem with packaging and marketing records so that they get to the top of the charts and I think that some people on here have been missing the point...which is-

It's not the fact that it's the Christmas number one, a protest can be made at any time of the year but realistically if you could choose a week to make a protest which one would it be? Those who downloaded Killing In The Name don't give a toss who the Christmas number one is, they just see it at the most effective time to protest.

And whilst I am still ranting- Those who feel sorry for Joe...Eh? He has just won a competion and the prize is fame and fortune, if he is sensible he will be made for life......ahhhh, poor sod!

Fuck you I won't do what you tell me.......but I WILL do what somebody else tells me to do, even if it is a futile exercise to "stick it to the man" in an industry that is so blatently manipulated already. I love RATM, I hate Simon Cowell, but the irony and general futility of the situation appears to have been lost on most people.

@ Wolf ... ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha haaaaa..... omg i've just laughed out loud for real - in the middle of a packed office!!
Willowluckynottogetsacked!

I think a point I'd like to make is the way the way this will be seen by young people. Programmes like the x factor are very influencial to young people. And wouldn't it be tragic if all young musicians aspired to be the latest x factor winner. Which a lot of them do. Young people are now getting to see a real band that play real intruments that are politically aware. I hope young people now aspire more like RATM than her today gone tomorrow karaoke joe•. If just one kid is inspred to pick up an electric guitar or a set of sticks then its been worth it

I think a point I'd like to make is the way the way this will be seen by young people. Programmes like the x factor are very influencial to young people. And wouldn't it be tragic if all young musicians aspired to be the latest x factor winner. Which a lot of them do. Young people are now getting to see a real band that play real intruments that are politically aware. I hope young people now aspire more like RATM than her today gone tomorrow karaoke joe•. If just one kid is inspred to pick up an electric guitar or a set of sticks then its been worth it

Sorry blackberry is doing multiple posts apologies

ive always really liked rage against the machine, i thought it was a cool campaign to see them at number 1, i have had the album since 1992, i bought the download twice

ive nothing against simon cowell, joe , louis , cheryl or dannii(especially nothing against cheryl and dannii)

i dont know why but i really dont have any debate or strong discussion to give on this as i dont have any partular opinion on the charts and all that stuff
does anyone else just really like the band and thats why they bought it like i did? :-)))))))))

but I WILL do what somebody else tells me to do-

Well some people are happy to sit back and moan whilst others prefer to shout F*ck you I won't buy what you tell me.

Who cares who listens it just feels better

It has to be one campaign for everyone to get behind. I suggest the same people run next years campaign as well to keep some continuity. I would like to see an independant label though AND the song has to rebel in some way and not be too pleasant on the ears otherwise Cowell will probably end up buying it anyway!

and journey's dont stop believin got to number 9, that was another facebook campaign too :-))))))))))))

OMFG!! Never mind Journey ... listen to the song at the start!!
All That You Dream for Xmas #1 2010!!!
by the fantastic Little Feat
(not their best song by any means, but a great song on a great album, The Last Record Album (which wasn't))
wooooooooo hoooooooooooooo
Willow

"I also highly doubt that this is the first time that Joe has come in the number 2 slot ;-))"

Lmao!your probably rite!

Hey Nidge... look what you started ,what a stirrer!! Great blog and RATM won WOOHOO

@ Robert Redfern. I bought it cos it's a great track by a great band too. I also bought it cos when I heard about the facebook page I thought it was cool and funny and even a bit of 2 fingers up at the typical stuff in the charts especially at christmas.